@Seiya-Meteorite  
“I didn’t think he deserved it as he did scatter Amore to pieces and enslaved the ponies for 1000 years and such, and to me, the whole way he was reformed felt half-assed and rushed to me. If you disagree, that’s fine.”
 
It’s interesting that he scatters her and doesn’t outright destroy her, which Fiendship is Magic 1 implies he could have done. His motivations are really confusing to me, and I’m still trying to work through them. It’s clear he’s motivated by revenge, to the point of impulsively making decisions out of a desire to retaliate, but what does he think about the Umbrums? Does he believe them to be victims of the Crystal Empire unjustly imprisoned? Or does he think them to be the monsters the Crystal ponies say they are? If so, why did he not release them because he feared they wouldn’t be monsters?
 
As to enslaving the crystal ponies for 1000 years, I think you’re overstating what he did. He cast a spell to make the Empire disappear for 1000 years, and the S3 opener suggests that the enslaved ponies had no recollection of that time period. It’s like they were all just transported 1000 years into the future, so the time they experience in bondage (yum) was a lot less than that. From their perspective, they were enslaved to do a bunch of digging, had memory spells casted upon them to make them forget about Sombra, were made to feel pretty shitty, and then rescued all within a pretty short time span. All the damage Sombra caused is reversed, with the exception of Amore, whom will be recovered as implied by the comic.
 
I suppose if all the evil the villain did factors into your calculations as to that villain’s second-chance-worthiness, Sombra’s done a lot more bad than Luna, who seems to have, in her brief stint as NMM, blasted a whole bunch of the Castle of the Two Sisters and wounded Celestia. Then again, Luna did nothing to merit a second chance, unlike Sombra.
 
What do you think about Discord being given a second chance in S3? He’s done so much more evil than Sombra. If he deserved that chance, so does Sombra deserve this chance.

@dynamicv  
re: Sombra
 
Not to mention, he intends to seek out and bring back Amore, who’s ultimately responsible for these events, presumably to make amends with her.

@ichingdivine
 
I think you make a good argument for why Sombra deserves forgiveness.
 
I’d also like to add that he already spent 1000 years in an icy prison for his actions, then got blown up for good measure after his other attempt. Like Luna and Discord, he’s already had his fair share of punishment. Now that he has sided with good instead of evil, he should definitely get another chance. And what’s the first thing he wants to do with his second chance? To try and bring back Amore, atoning for yet another of his past misdeeds. And he came up with that idea on his own. Knowing all of this, Celestia letting him go free feels right.
 
As for Radiant Hope, she had good intentions and she managed to save Sombra in the end. I think she deserves forgiveness because the problems with her plan were not entirely her fault.
 
<BEGIN HYPOTHETICAL SCENARIO>  
Hypothetically, if things had gone exactly as Radiant Hope had first planned, here’s what should have happened: instead of running outside to fight Twilight, Sombra does what Hope was expecting him to do and he frees the Umbrum right away. The intended results of Hope’s original plan:
 

@ichingdivine  
Whatever…I’m glad Starlight was reformed also, and I do like her, but with comic Sombra (remember, this is non-canon to the show), I didn’t think he deserved it as he did scatter Amore to pieces and enslaved the ponies for 1000 years and such, and to me, the whole way he was reformed felt half-assed and rushed to me. If you disagree, that’s fine.

@Seiya-Meteorite
 
“Then that’s like saying Celestia never should have gotten her sister back, which is stupid IMO. >:(”
 
You may really like a reformed villain (I think Luna is great, and it was a great thing that Celestia did to try to reconcile with her sister), but how likeable a character is plays no role in how much they deserve their second chance. Sombra, out of all the reformed villains, deserves his second chance the most. If you think Luna deserves her second chance, then you must also conclude that Sombra deserves his as well.

@PonyPon  
True, true…
 
But I dunno what to say about this comic series anymore except that I’m relieved it’s over, and I hope the sequel they’re implying never happens. But that’s just my opinion.

@Seiya-Meteorite  
Well, he was dissolved and reformed for like the fourth time.
 
Who’s to say what the stability and malleability of his mind is by now?

@Starswirl  
Sombra’s still feels rushed and kinda forced to me…he just turns good snap like that? That’s just what I think though.

@ichingdivine  
Now that might’ve worked better. Throw in them actually showing some sort of remorse that’s not based on just Hope and Sombra feeling bad for each other, and the ending could’ve even been good. I mean, even Starlight gave us that when she went back to Equaltown. Her redemption was more satisfying than what Hope here had; Sombra’s is mostly okay.

@ichingdivine  
Then that’s like saying Celestia never should have gotten her sister back, which is stupid IMO. >:(

@ichingdivine  

@Pagan
 
“At least he would have had some modicum of dignity left this however is just pathetic, this isn’t even Sombra anymore it’s a counterpart nothing more at least the other villain redemptions didn’t change the characters Discord is still Discord and so on but Sombra might as well go by a different name cause this a complete butchering of his character he didn’t decide to become this he was magically changed.”
 
 
He would have had more dignity left had he just went back with the Umbrums?  
Reformed Sombra is the same character as King Sombra right after returning the Crystal Heart; he only looks different since the dark magic was removed. Reformed Sombra is basically young Sombra before gaining his shadow powers from the Umbrum Crystal. The comics would argue that without the belief that he’s destined to be a weapon for the Umbrums and to conquer and sin in their name, this is Sombra. He’s not evil Sombra, but that’s because he’s had the epiphany that he controls his destiny.
 
And while he may not have chosen to be reformed, he wasn’t complaining when he was being reformed. He didn’t choose to be reformed not because he didn’t want or wanted not to be reformed, but because he thought that slotting in the heart was a one way ticket to Umbrum hell. If you had asked Sombra while he was dissipating if he’d rather spent an eternity with his people he just betrayed, or be reformed, which do you think he’d pick?
 
Discord post reformation is the only character that remains similar to himself pre-reformation. Luna and Sunset are completely different. How do you feel about those them?

@Seiya-Meteorite
 
So if you don’t think Sombra deserves a second chance, neither should you believe that Starlight, Discord, Luna, or Shimmer deserve theirs.

@Seiya-Meteorite
 
“I dunno if the whole thing about Luna would count though, considering it’s still the first episode she got redeemed and she had plenty of screentime and some episodes afterward that made her a good character.”
 
When I say that Sombra deserved his redemption even more so than any other villain in MLP, I don’t mean currently, after 5 seasons, that Sombra is a better person or has done more good than any other reformed character.
 
 
What I mean is that Sombra, at the moment in which he is given a second chance, has done more to earn his second chance than any other villain character has done at the moment of their being given a second chance. Take Luna, she was fully set on carrying out her plan of sole rule of Equestria had she not been force-fed a dose of rainbow, and Discord, who before being given a second chance, had been turned into stone after trying to turn the world upside down…again. Or Sunset, who had to have her demonic powers stripped away from her. These characters had to have reformation FORCED upon them. They were given a second chance after being defeated and placed at the mercy of their vanquishers, and they were told “be good, or else”.
 
Starlight is the only reformed villain comparable to Sombra. Like Sombra, she, before being given her second chance, had the ability to realize her goals and cross the moral event horizon. She could have easily torn that spell paper and trapped Twilight permanently in the future, away from her friends, and thus exact her revenge. There was nothing the heroes could do to either Starlight or Sombra to force them to stop, they had to do so of their own free will.
 
What makes what Sombra returning and not smashing the Heart even more heroic is than Starlight not ripping the spell is that unlike Starlight, Sombra would achieve all his goals by smashing the Heart. The biggest threats to him in the form of the princesses and the Heart would be removed, the Umbrums would become a permanent fixture of the world, and he could proceed with his plans for world domination. If Starlight had ripped the spell, she’d be condemning all of Equestria to a dystopian future along with Twilight, which would conflict with her sympathy and compassion, and herself to the same future, which would conflict with her more selfish sense of self preservation. Had both characters acted selfishly, Sombra’s future would have aligned with all his main desires, whereas Starlight’s future would have aligned with some and conflicted with others.
 
I’ve explained previously on the bad things that would happen to Sombra if he were to act ethically; he  
would effectively be committing suicide, if he were that lucky. Nothing of the sort would have happened to Starlight if she were to act ethically. She would be returning to a future governed by some of the most forgiving rulers there are, after arguably doing no harm at all to anyone. Her punishment would, if she were to be punished, quite light. And if she chose to, she could have bolted the instant she returned to the main timeline. Twilight, trying her best to neutralize Starlight, couldn’t stop her during their multiple fights, so there’s no reason to expect she could stop a Starlight that actively wished to escape (Starlight turning herself over to the authorities is something she doesn’t get enough credit for, she really wants to make amends for things she arguably didn’t do).
 
Starlight isn’t committing to nearly the sacrifice that Sombra is by acting virtuously, and she’s the only one even comparable to Sombra because prior to her second chance, she’s the only other villain that acted in a way that could be described as “virtuous”.

Griffith says hi.

@ichingdivine  
I dunno if the whole thing about Luna would count though, considering it’s still the first episode she got redeemed and she had plenty of screentime and some episodes afterward that made her a good character.

@ichingdivine  
I agree, good idea, which I sadly think you put more effort in than Whitley did :’(
 
IMO though, Sombra really isn’t abusing Hope, most of the time, he’s acting like she doesn’t exist.
 
By first place I meant, maybe in issue #34, and then while Sombra could be destroyed, Hope could be explaining about her friendship with Sombra to the others, and then Sombra could somehow find a way to save himself and turn good again, that way, we all would have been spared this filler and shittiness. But either way, it wouldn’t have felt right as I don’t think Sombra deserved to be redeemed also. At least Starlight Glimmer felt guilty or such….
 
Heck what I’m kinda thinking is, I’ve seen some people complain (on an unrelated topic) about some of the characters doing what they did in the classic Rudolph special, but Donner actually got called out on what he was doing by Santa, felt guilt, and was able to find his son and apologize! I digress though…
 
But yeah, fuck Radiant Hope.
 
To anyone who does like her, if you do, that’s OK though, and I respect your opinion.

@Seiya-Meteorite  
“But it still wasn’t done right and it exposed a big weakness; Sombra/Hope could have just done that in the FIRST PLACE, and then it would have been done better.”
 
The way Sombra’s redemption was executed was bad. Hope should have slotted the Crystal Heart back in place the moment she recovered enough from Twi’s blast to shuffle into position. And then she could have been caught by Rabia who gives Sombra the heart to destroy, who then puts it back to redeem himself. It should have been absolutely necessary to save Equestria, but instead, it’s forced. “Sombra needs to be redeemed, so let’s give him the Crystal Heart!”. The last we saw of Hope, she had resigned herself to Sombra’s villainy. Why is she still giving him chance after chance when Equestria is about to fall? Hope is terrible. She’s like the abused wife who keeps on coming back to her abusive husband, and will even defend him to no end.
 
They could have easily solved this too. Just have a throwaway line that the altar of the Heart is too well guarded, or show a bunch of Umbrums around it, and it would make Hope giving Sombra the Heart look like a last ditch maneuver to save Twi and Cadence, but instead it just seems like Hope is, yet again, giving Sombra another chance he has done nothing to deserve. I suppose he may have been expressing some self-doubt the last time he talked with Hope, but enough to stake all of Equestria on?
 
Fuck Hope.
 
I am curious to which place you mean by “they could have done that in the FIRST PLACE”.

@Pagan  
It would be cool if in the future, Sombra turns into his shadow form and goes berserk when he is pissed when someone tries to harm Hope, only for Hope to calm him down.
 
Kind of like the Hulk and Bruce banner/Jekyll and Hyde sort of transformation.

@ichingdivine  
We’re also mostly mad at Hope, not Sombra.

@ichingdivine  
But it still wasn’t done right and it exposed a big weakness; Sombra/Hope could have just done that in the FIRST PLACE, and then it would have been done better.

@ichingdivine  
At least he would have had some modicum of dignity left this however is just pathetic, this isn’t even Sombra anymore it’s a counterpart nothing more at least the other villain redemptions didn’t change the characters Discord is still Discord and so on but Sombra might as well go by a different name cause this a complete butchering of his character he didn’t decide to become this he was magically changed.
 
I hope IDW doesn’t “redeem” Chrysalis she’d become a flowery nerd with a completely different look if they did apparently IDW doesn’t believe you can change on your own and they have to write them so that they are magically altered into a good guy rather than just doing it naturally.

@ichingdivine  
You’re right about at least half of those…

@Pagan
 
“Still would have been better.”
 
So after Sombra foils the plot of the Umbrums, with the full expectation of facing the Umbrum music upon his return to the Shadow Realm, he deserves to suffer for eternity or die at the hands of the monsters that set his miserable existence into motion in the first place?
 
No other character with the exception of Starlight Glimmer has redeemed themselves to the extent that Sombra did here. If he could have easily wiped out the resistance and taken over the world, but he chose instead to banish the Umbrums and himself back to the Shadow Realm, knowing that he’d have to face their wrath. That’s metal as fuck, and more metal than any thing any other villain has done to be reformed. If Sombra doesn’t deserve redemption, neither does Luna, Discord, Sunset, or Starlight.

@ichingdivine  
Justice is revenge people don’t get picked on for wanting.
 
Perhaps it’s just human to want someone, whether through malicious acts or incredible ignorance, to pay for their blunders and outright crimes instead of just getting what they want and making karma look like a lazy bitch, if not completely false.