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Faust had creative control taken away from her after Hasbro saw the runaway success MLP was having at the time.
What is Sludge doing for most of the episode?
No it doesn’t say they can’t go back, but as is the case with the “teen” dragons, they don’t have any reason to go back to their family and do not have anything close to a “nice” social structure. Everything the dragons have shown is that they view any sympathy, any remorse, anything where you’re not showing just how much of an awesome dragon you are, you’re going to get backstabbed and/or crushed underfoot. Do you not recall the story Smolder told for hearthswarming?
True, we’ve not seen a “middle” ground. We get baby (first hatched Spike), stunted teen (spike as a whole), teen (smolder, ember, garble, etc) then adult (torch, Dragonshy dragon, owls well dragon). This episode even went against the rules as Spike did nothing but give stuff to Sludge, but he didn’t grow, despite him being a greedy slime who wanted Spike’s life for himself and got it with Spike as his gofer.
I won’t deny that “Spike’s nature” may be more apparent at the moment, but here is a problem: Spike never ever showed any inclination of caring about his biological roots. He had one teen rebellious moment (dragon quest) and learned his lesson. Yes, Sludge claimed to be family and caring about Spike, but Spike and… pretty much EVERYONE ELSE just suddenly believing him (when all 6 saw how much of a cheepskate and a slacker he was and how his stories had holes so big you could lose an ursa major in them) was just downright absurd, even for this show.
The scene re-enforced that Spike, even being friends with the Dragon Lord, is under no protection. Even when Spike and RD are in the right, the other dragons present don’t do anything and fall back on “might makes right” and any conflict, they just watched happen without taking sides. They may not have helped Garble, but they didn’t help Spike either and even when Spike won and Garble was going to beat on him anyway, they did nothing. It was up to RD pulling a Dragon type trick by backstabbing Garble for them to get what they needed.
It’s been mentioned, actually. Notably Spike’s personal closeness to Celestia in a few distinct moments.
One is here:
your current filter.Spike has access to the crown jewels and he has access to Celestia’s Golden Apple tree (which could be the source of her and Luna’s longevity). But we never see any of this, we only see Donut Joe’s shop.
The next was in Lesson Zero where Spike went directly to Celestia after Twilight cast a spell that nearly destroyed all of Ponyville because she was off her rocker. Spike and Celestia have a special bond that, if anything, is even CLOSER that twilight and Celestia, but there was no chance to elaborate on it before faust was kicked off the team.
And sorry, but I really REALLY don’t want the continuity where THIS sequence of events happened, making celestia and twilight’s parents utter morons and making Spike’s life nothing but torture since the day he was hatched.
your current filter.This is one of two reasons why I balk anytime someone tries to enforce the idea of “twilight is mom to Spike”.
We saw one dragon in the dragon lands with an interest in pillows (namely stealing them from ponies), but where was it ever stated dragons in general love pillows?
She stated they are kicked out, but she never said they can’t come back (Torch and Ember’s example would argue that they can come back home once the molt period is over). And even if not, nothing is stopping the parents from explaining the intricacies of advanced flying maneuvers before the molt happens.
Dragons seems to vary a fair amount in size, not to mention we have no idea which large dragons are that way through natural growth or “greed-induced bigness.”
There is a difference though in that Sludge claimed to be very close family and to care about Spike. The same can’t be said about Garble and his group. Also I think its reasonable to have Spike being more interested in his dragon nature this season, since he has had to deal with it more and more (be it the molting or the flying lessons).
Wait, how did that scene show that? Spike specifically went to help Rainbow negotiate, they just unfortunately had to deal with Garble, the dragon that likes Spike the least. Spike didn’t exhibit any sign that he views dragons as a whole as untrustworthy.
While I do like Faust’ original vision that Celestia raised Spike, I have to admit the show never gave any support for it, instead repeatedly presenting Spike as having stayed with Twilight his whole life. Its nothing new, it was just really emphasized in this episode.
The implication on the molt aspect is that is what drives dragons away from their family, full stop and why there are tons of delinquent “teen” dragons. Smolder’s brother was older and she agreed to kick him out with her family.
The problem is that Sludge isn’t even in the “imposing” range of any of the other full adults, so he comes off as nothing more than a “slightly older teen”. His fatness and terrible flying ability showcase how his lifestyle revolves around lying about everything to get others to do things for him. As for imposing, Torch still retains this, he’s just smart and would do no good stomping out all the youths when he is needing to pass the scepter on.
At best, they have a “I met you in the hallway on the way to class” relationship. That said, yes, Spike is much closer to… basically everyone else.
I still feel Spike is stunted in his growth and is technically older than Smolder. But honestly, Smolder was sent to the school of friendship likely because Ember had caught onto the fact that Smolder has a cutesy, innocent side to her that the ponies wouldn’t judge her for. On the flipside, greed and self importance is very natural to a dragon and fits with about every facet of their society being nothing but clashing and fighting and wanting to keep away from each other.
It was established that Spike saw the mane 6 as his family as a whole (Dragon quest) and his willingness to say and do cruel things to twilight without batting an eye reeks of a brother/sister relationship.
Basically, I agree with pretty much most of what you said.
Edited
Young adult. Less than a hundred. Dragons are weird. XD
Edited
Smolder never said they had no family bonds. She specifically said she loves her brother, proving that they do have lasting family bonds, but that didn’t stop her from wanting him kicked out of the house when he got the molt smell.
It’s clear that adult dragons were retconned from the enormous smoke-belching terrors of S1 (Dragonshy; Owl’s Well That Ends Well). Up through Dragonquest, it was implied the adults were the big things from S1, and babies and teens were of the Spike/Garble sort. But that changed with Gauntlet of Fire. Even Torch, huge as he was, was more like a big Garble than a S1 dragon. Honestly, that bothers me; I don’t like retcons and the loss of the menace of S1 dragons is one of my least favorite aspects of FiM. Though Ember and Smolder are a wonderful consolation prize. But Sludge is pretty consistent with an adult dragon of smaller size since Gauntlet, if not sooner in the comics.
On this I agree. Spike x Smolder has a brother/sister vibe, not mates. Sparity 4ever.
Ember personally chose Smolder (a baby dragon not much older than Spike) to go to the friendship school. Spike had never met a trustworthy one before, but that doesn’t prove that Ember was the only one ever, anywhere. We, the audience, have only seen a tiny handful of dragons ever, and mostly Garble and crew. Is the species really intended to be represented by a teen delinquent bully, or was he intended to be a teen delinquent bully? We know it’s not biological because Spike isn’t that way.
@Background Pony #7B78
Spike’s REAL family is Twilight. Aside from them never being there (and maybe being as dead as Applejack’s), his biological parents would’ve kicked him out already. Twilight’s a better family than he could ever have any other way.
-Smolder contradicts the fact that dragons know of and love pillows but don’t get to usually keep them because fire
-Smolder said “dragon parents don’t use their offspring”. She’s technically right because she said in Molt Down that as soon as the molt is started, a dragon is kicked out of their family and they don’t have family bonds (Torch & Ember is as nice as it ever gets)
-Sludge is hardly any bigger than Garble but easily convinces everyone “he’s an adult”, which is bull honkey and he’s obviously still a youngster only barely older than the “teen” dragons
-For all the push for a Spike x Smolder friendship, it does not come off as fluid in any manner and is basically Smolder going “Spike, you’re an idiot.” and Spike going “Oh, yeah, I am.”
But the most viciously glaring problem?
The whole reason Smolder is in ponyville is because Spike accepted he was more pony than dragon and that those who took the time to love and be with him are more valuable than biological relations who don’t care about him, thus he fought for said Ponies by entering the gauntlet, forging a friendship with EMBER, and establishing the first peaceful connection between pony and dragon in the history of ever.
But, lol, Josh Haber apparently never watched Dragon quest OR Gauntlet of fire to learn that Spike learned that lesson.
He also didn’t even pay attention to his own writing (or Nicole’s) during Shadow Play part 2 where any dragon that ISN’T EMBER can’t be trusted and that Spike doesn’t trust them.
That’s not even getting into the whole “twilight raised me” bs, that’s an argument that will conquer an entire submission.
Jeeze what a mess.