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47 comments posted
Incursor

@Starless
Even if there is forgiveness, there shouldn’t be. Nobody deserves to be forgiven for anything. Nobody should ever be given a second chance, no matter how repentant they are. You wouldn’t let a pedophile or serial killer go with a slap on the wrist, would you?
A well meaning effort that accidentally caused harm and risked their life to fix showing genuine repentance IS NOT comparable to or as unforgivably heinous as such.
I agree Discord deserved worse than he got, but still deserved less than the villains for all the reasons discussed. What would you consider a forgivable level of wrongdoing (which DOES/SHOULD exist in real life as society wouldn’t be as functional as it is otherwise)?
Showing such an naively black and white view about forgiveness, refusing to acknowledge or counter-argue the arguments/in-work logic raised against his irredeemability, ignoring attempts at compromise when we half-agreed with you, and STILL refusing to explain why you’re following a show completely contradictory to your beliefs is only proving yourself wrong. Worse, it’s proving YOU KNOW YOU’RE WRONG if you’re putting such effort into ignoring as opposed to refuting all the arguments/evidence that your belief if unfair/illogical.
If you don’t want your opinions/beliefs challenged, you can just stop partaking in this debate/stop following the show. You’re not going to convince anyone otherwise and only discredit yourself if you keep doing what you’re doing.
Posted Report
Starless
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Champion - Led the charge of major battles for the New Lunar Republic, bringing swift and crushing defeat to the forces of the Solar Empire (April Fools 2023).
Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
King Sombra - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of The Crystal Empire!
Artist -
Non-Fungible Trixie -

Prog rock pony
@Andyxdr
@Background Pony #300D
@Incursor
Even if there is forgiveness, there shouldn’t be. Nobody deserves to be forgiven for anything. Nobody should ever be given a second chance, no matter how repentant they are. You wouldn’t let a pedophile or serial killer go with a slap on the wrist, would you?
Posted Report
Incursor

@Starless
But she didn’t.
But she did intend to kill them, which you said before was enough to justify her punishment.
Which is a problem with the series as a whole. The real world isn’t forgiving like MLP, but the little girls who watch MLP won’t learn that but instead they may think everyone will forgive them if they apologize. In reality, expressing repentance isn’t going change anything or might even make things worse. There’s no true forgiveness.
But the alternative, never forgiving even if they were well meaning/show repentance, is just as if not more harmful and unviable.
Yes this show may have dropped the ball in S9 but if you’re so absolutely again the shows fundamental ideals you’re refusing to even consider how to fix/salvage it (or even acknowledge/give counterarguments to most of the arguments I’ve raised against), why are you a fan of/following a work so opposed to that belief such you’re aware of Discord’s actions?
@Andyxdr
Others disagreeing are not evidence they’re wrong. Please limit objections to factual evidence/logical arguments against or you’ll make your side look bad.
Posted Report
Background Pony #300D
@Starless
The world is not absolute. There’s not usually immediate forgiveness, but the world still cannot work without it.
Shunning down forgiveness on principle is equally as narrow as rejecting punishment and concequences since there’s a moment one needs to keep going and not everybody has the desire of keeping grudges alive, especially if they get drained to the point grudges become unable to hold up, or at least too taxing to constantly maintaining them, fun fact, forgiveness itself has a hidden pragmatic reason as well, it avoids getting energy drained with people that are not really anymore in a position to hurt you for whatever reason, saved energy one can use for real productive stuff or to focus in protecting from actual important things.
Posted Report
Starless
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Champion - Led the charge of major battles for the New Lunar Republic, bringing swift and crushing defeat to the forces of the Solar Empire (April Fools 2023).
Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
King Sombra - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of The Crystal Empire!
Artist -
Non-Fungible Trixie -

Prog rock pony
@Incursor
Cozy did attempt to kill
But she didn’t.
I concede this would be as unforgivable in a more cynical series. But this is a series where optimism is a physical force and the rule if forgiveness to anyone who expresses genuine repentance.
Which is a problem with the series as a whole. The real world isn’t forgiving like MLP, but the little girls who watch MLP won’t learn that but instead they may think everyone will forgive them if they apologize. In reality, expressing repentance isn’t going change anything or might even make things worse. There’s no true forgiveness.
Posted Report
Incursor

@Andyxdr
Whether this opinion upsets fans is irrelevant to this argument, which is just about the in-universe logic behind it. Stop using the Ad Hominem of criticizing their opinion as being unpopular, you’re hurting your argument by using it instead of in-work facts.
@Starless
Cozy did attempt to kill the heroes in the S9 finale.
That aside Discord didn’t intend for them to take over Equestria, he intended that they be stopped before that but screwed up royally, which is just stupidity as opposed to evilness.
I concede this would be as unforgivable in a more cynical series. But this is a series where optimism is a physical force and the rule if forgiveness to anyone who expresses genuine repentance. It’s so fundamental to the work I ask why, if it’s such a deal breaker for you, you care about the work enough to follow in and be so upset about this as opposed to ignoring the whole work?
Posted Report
Starless
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Champion - Led the charge of major battles for the New Lunar Republic, bringing swift and crushing defeat to the forces of the Solar Empire (April Fools 2023).
Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
King Sombra - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of The Crystal Empire!
Artist -
Non-Fungible Trixie -

Prog rock pony
@Andyxdr
Cozy Glow didn’t kill anyone either. Well intentioned or not, Discord still released Cozy Glow and Tirek from tartarus and had them and Chrysalis work together to take over Equestria. Murder isn’t the only unforgivable crime.
Posted Report
Background Pony #300D
@Starless
Well she was unrepentant and would never lift a hoof to fix anything, neither her mistakes nor somebody else.
Posted Report
Incursor

@Andyxdr
This isn’t helpful argument as this isn’t about them disliking/disagreeing with fans for not harping on Discord, this is just their reaction to Discord himself.
Posted Report
Andyxdr
Solar Guardian - Refused to surrender in the face of the Lunar rebellion and showed utmost loyalty to the Solar Empire (April Fools 2023).
Cool Crow - "Caw!" An awesome tagger
Magnificent Metadata Maniac - #1 Assistant
Artist -
Preenhub - We all know what you were up to this evening~

Glowin' up!
@Starless
Can you please just live with the fact that Discord was forgiven and got a happy ending? That’s what people who like him wanted and it’s not like you’ll die if he never gets turned back to stone.
Posted Report
Incursor

@Starless
Even if he realized his mistake and decided he wouldn’t use such methods again, it was acknowledged how the difference between Celestia and other doing similar “lessons” and mistakes was luck, he got a episode/movie to show this lesson stuck/having to work to earn back trust, lost/sacrificed his powers as penance (and maybe prison time), and he gave due effort/chance to redeem the villains/only petrified them for until someone who might be able to redeem them like happened for him came along?
If you’re refusing to even consider such and not give counterarguments to his mitigating circumstances (I acknowledge/accept your counterarguments that the villains deserved worse/likewise and Discord causes more trouble than he’s worth, but haven’t seen any to the other points), do you see why many will deem your dislike unfair/irrational?
Or does this a matter of the perspective we’re judging him by? I’m judging him by in-universe logic/precedent which is that anyone who shows genuine remorse deserves forgiveness and analysis of the work/how it could be improved. Your’s seems to be your emotional reaction to the character without interest/caring in thinking things thought (the same thing that caused Discord to make his bad S9 decisions), which I can accept for response to fiction but condemn if done in real life. We can end this debate which will just drag on if we can’t even agree on what we’re debating (opinion of the character vs. narrative logic/analysis).
Posted Report
Starless
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Champion - Led the charge of major battles for the New Lunar Republic, bringing swift and crushing defeat to the forces of the Solar Empire (April Fools 2023).
Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
King Sombra - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of The Crystal Empire!
Artist -
Non-Fungible Trixie -

Prog rock pony
@Incursor
There isn’t anything he can do to deserve a second chance after the S9 finale.
@Andyxdr
Anything can upset anyone. Fans being upset about season 9 or MLP as a whole was inevitable. The only way that could have been avoided is if MLP never existed at all, then it wouldn’t have had any fans to upset.
Posted Report
CORDZ2000
Solar Hero - Went above and beyond for the Solar Deity, drawing from the power of the sun itself to bring balance to the fight against the Lunar Insurrection (April Fools 2023).

Draconequues Lover zcord
@Incursor
@Starless
@Starless
If Discord’s S9 actions were motivated by the same level of selfishness/maliciousness as his S4 finales, I’d agree he’s past the point of forgives regardless of his remorse.
But his S9 actions were instead a well intentioned effort to use the villains to help the heroes, the same trick Celestia used since day one, that blew up due to his arrogance/incompetence which he showed remorse for and risked his life to help fix.
@Starless
While I agree with that argument Discord deserved worse consequences, equivalent of execution is unfair especially if it was considered unfair for the villains who committed willful and deliberate evildoing (turning ponykind against each other, attempted murder) independently of “Grogar” forcing them and were 100% remorseless and made clear they would refuse redemption even if they’d been given due effort/chance to.
Most unbias, understandable, logical and reasonable response I think I’ve ever seen involving this situation
Posted Report
Incursor

@Starless
Which again ignores mitigating context he had that actual/full villains didn’t (G5 being a genuinely well intentioned effort, the difference from what the heroes wanted being the extremes he went, which he did get due remorse for).
But you keep ignoring my question, what would he have to do/have to change in order for him deserve a second chance after the S9 finale?
Posted Report
Background Pony #4AB9
@Starless
For the record, his actions in the G5 comic was justified even though he was misguided about getting rid of magic after it returned at the end of the fifth generation movie and because of Opaline’s actions that set the events in motion. It took Izzy and her friends to use the recorded message from Fluttershy to show Discord to give magic a chance.
And Discord turning back to stone is still out of the question but you still don’t bother to see it that way..
Posted Report