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Description
Daring Do episodes bring out the worst in Rainbow Dash… Even if he wasn’t alone, she cowered and gave up before his help was revealed. Heck, this episode began with Rainbow Dash thinking Daring Do was in physical danger and wanted to save her. Why is it that when she does find that danger, she instantly gives up?
Source
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I just wanted to say: Dammit, I miss Seabreeze.
Similar thing happens in the Sonic Rainboom episode. She was curled up in a ball there and during the performance, performed badly compared to her training. But when danger struck, she performed past her usual abilities. During crucial moments where lives are at stake, it certainly doesn’t stop her from at least trying. The Wonderbolts Acadamy is another example.
Edited
I think the closest we have to a logical explanation for Rainbow’s behavior here is what I brought up earlier: her state of morale. Rainbow was so broken upon seeing her attempt at clearing Daring Do’s image only spark even greater hatred towards her Idol that she was literally moments away from crying. Now, this does run seemingly counter to her usual charisma, but we have seen before in the series Dash becoming so disheartened that she would rather curl up in a a ball and wallow in her own sadness (ex. “The Mysterious Mare Do Well”, “Testing, Testing 123”). The difference with the scene of her running into the swarm of flyders in “Campfire Tales” that you brought up is that she was full of determination and drive to retrieve the campfire and in the grander scheme salvage what she could of their fun weekend trip. She was not doubting herself or viewing herself as worthless then, as she was in “Daring Done” just prior to being ambushed by Caballeron and his henchponies.
Edited
If this was true, he would’ve silenced her mouth rather than blind folding her.
And her cries for help wouldn’t?
This is not the way Rainbow Dash thinks you know. A few episodes ago, 3 ponies and 3 fillies were camping in a forest. Rainbow Dash was one of them. Her scared little sister was one of them. Flyders come by and start eating their food, and them. They escape to a cave. They’re safe, but have no campfire. What does Rainbow Dash do? She doesn’t think about the danger that is clearly outside, ready to end her life the moment she goes out there. She flies out there just so the fillies can enjoy having a campfire to keep them comfortable, in exchange for the damage SHE had to endure.
Something worse could’ve happened to her than just a few bite marks. She could’ve gotten hit by one of their webs, had her wings bound, and be eaten alive. She could’ve ended up having her scared little sister left all alone again. Or worse, put her friends’ lives in jeopardy becaause she carelessly threw herself in danger, and now they’re trying to save her. Instead, they get webbed, and they get eaten alive as well. Her little sister would be even more alone than before, and most likely killed herself.
But hey, none of that happened. Rainbow Dash doesn’t care. She doesn’t think about the smallest details that could get her killed. So then why would she be thinking about all these similar details with Caballeron?
Where do all the Mane Six live? In Ponyville! Where did Rainbow Dash and Pinkie Pie learn AK Yearling was retiring? In Ponyville! Where does AK Yearling live? Not In Ponyville!
Rainbow Dash thought Daring Do was in danger BEFORE leaving Ponyville. She went to Daring Do expecting trouble, but didn’t bother to tell the others. That’s saying that the trouble she was expecting would be something she could handle herself. It isn’t until AFTER she finds Daring Do that she learns what’s going on, making your claim that the trouble she’s expecting when she left to find Daring Do, null and avoid.
I never said she went to Somnambula expecting the trouble of Newspapers and villagers. I said she was going to Daring Do expecting trouble.
Since you’re willfully missing the entire point, this will be my last comment on the matter.
……….- because killing her would attract unwanted attention
……….- because keeping her alive would let her be used as bait to get Daring Do also
……….- If she’s raising a ruckus anyway, raising a ruckus by killing her is no longer a greater problem than the status quo; the ruckus and unwanted attention are there. Killing her would shut it up faster than letting it continue.
……….- and the possibility she would succeed would render her useless as bait,
……….- meaning that if she fought back, Caballeron would then have no reason to keep her alive, and every reason to kill her on the spot.
……….- whereas if she didn’t fight back and stayed quiet, then Caballeron still had two good reasons to keep her alive at least for a while.
……….- In hindsight it wasn’t a very good plan. I’ve never said it was. I said it was reasonable for her to think it might have been a good idea in the moment.
With full benefit of hindsight and the audience perspective, you managed to realize this wasn’t a good plan? Wow, you must be so proud.
your current filter.But the folder of newspaper clippings A.K. Yearling showed Rainbow and Pinkie said she trashed the whole town. It was only after they saw the newspaper clippings that they all went south to Somnambula to deal with the problem that the newspapers were trashing Daring Do and the villagers blamed her for a lot of destruction. Did you honestly forget that happened, or are you willfully ignoring the parts of the episode that prove you wrong? The problem they went to Somnambula to deal with was the southern newspapers and villagers. So it’s not at all surprising that they would be expecting to deal with… (drum roll) … the newspapers and villagers! Neither of which were expected to be dangerous. So again, it’s entirely reasonable that she wasn’t prepared to deal with Caballeron, because she was only expecting to deal with a bunch of villagers and a few journalists.
What the heck did Caballeron use in the past to make her reasonably believe she would die instantly if she resisted?
No. The newspaper RAINBOW DASH and PINKIE PIE read said AK Yearling was retiring. Rainbow Dash rushes over to where AK Yearling is because she believes Daring Do is in trouble.
Fly. Caballeron said he was gonna get rid of her. The only thing she can assume with going with him is certain death.
You are basing that on the assumption that Rainbow Dash has seen Caballeron kill somepony before using something that kills faster than they have a chance to resist. Besides, once they were out of town and in that pyramid, what was stopping him THEN from killing Rainbow Dash immediately? You’re basically saying Rainbow Dash feared that Caballeron would kill her the first opportunity he got, but going with him out of town where nopony would see them is not an opportunity.
Once again, you are contradicting yourself. You wanna know what makes a ruckus? Fighting back. You’re basically saying that if Rainbow Dash fought back, she could be injured, sure, but the ruckus would alert the authorities before she was killed. Wanna know something that kills instantly? A suppressor pistol shot to the head. Does Caballeron have one of those? What makes Rainbow Dash think he has one of those?
Either way, being captured still allowed Rainbow Dash to create a ruckus. She was yelling and screaming when she was being dragged away. CABALLERON DIDN’T CARE ABOUT THE RUCKUS. You wanna know what they did? They blind folded Rainbow Dash, instead of tying her mouth shut. If he didn’t want a ruckus, why did he blindfold Rainbow Dash instead of shuting her up?!
You’re basing this like Rainbow Dash had time to think of all abilities and consequences of her actions in a 5 second time frame, when all the information she got was, “I’m gonna take you away and kill you.” meaning going with him was certain death. How could she think of all the possibilities of resisting was gonna lead to certain death no matter what in just 5 seconds? I doubt she would even bother thinking about that at all.
This is why those other pictures are presented. They are surrounded by a swarm of Changelings, Rainbow Dash is the first to act. That sort of act could’ve easily gotten her killed right then and there. But she doesn’t think about that. Her thoughts are, “We gotta get past them.” Not. “If I act alone, I could possibly die instantly. So I should wait for the others because it’s safer.”
You’re not even explaining Caballeron’s or Rainbow Dash’s reasonings anymore. You’re explaining someone else’s reasons now.
Edited
No, I said it was reasonable for her to assume Caballeron would have killed her if she resisted. Which it was very reasonable to assume.
Um, the newspapers and the locals, exactly as A.K. Yearling told her was the problem before they went.
More like, “There isn’t really a good option here!!” So she picked what seemed like the better option out of a bad set.
The risk that Caballeron would kill her. There’s a difference between, “I’m not going to kill you now if you do what I say,” and “You just kicked me in the face and are making a big ruckus, so now I have nothing to lose by killing you immediately.”
Of course, nobody ever died screaming, took a while to die, or left a bunch of blood (not to mention vomit, urine, and feces) where they died. Nope, all murders are instant and clean.
Oh, wait…no, they’re not. It was in Caballeron’s best interest to not kill her in the middle of the town square. But if she created enough of a ruckus and attracted unwanted attention, so that there was no real stealth advantage to leaving her alive, well, I think it’s reasonable to assume Caballeron would be willing to change his plans and shut her up as fast as he could. Resisting and failing would be Rainbow Dash’s worst possible option. Resisting and succeeding would be her best option, but she couldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t end up being her worst option instead. Going along quietly was fairly middle-of-the road. At least she wasn’t going to die right then and there.
Um, duh. Because a) it’s the central point of the adventure genre that Daring Do is a parody of; and b) it’s a cartoon for preteen girls. Of course she was going to get away in the end! But in-world, she probably isn’t genre-savvy enough to know that. (Pinkie Pie, maybe. I could see her saying, “Ooh, is this where you start a pointlessly complicated plan to kill me slowly, and leave the key to my salvation just within reach to build dramatic tension, while you go off and don’t even see it through to completion?!?” Rainbow Dash, no.)
You’re the one who said she was gonna die if she resisted. The same logic applies if she doesn’t resist. The only reason she lives is because of Daring Do, which would happen both ways. But she wouldn’t know that ahead of time.
Daring Do’s nemesis is Ahuizotl, as well as Doctor Caballeron. Who else was she expecting to be causing trouble for Daring Do?
You really think those screams of terror say, “I’m gonna let myself be captured because it’s safer.”?
And now you just contradict one of your own reasonings. Let me refresh you.
According to what you just said, it won’t. That gives Rainbow Dash more reason to resist. If Caballeron wasn’t gonna kill Rainbow Dash in town, what risk was there in resisting then?
There’s also the fact that capturing her instead of killing her would be a greater risk of having the authorities know. If they killed her, she would be silent, and they could drag her body away. Nopony would know. But capturing her? She’s free to yell and call for help, letting the entire town know. Not to mention, take longer to drag her body away.
Capturing Rainbow Dash did the exact same thing.
Edited
So, Rainbow Dash is dead now? I must have been in another room taking a leak when that part of the episode happened.
She wasn’t. She was going to deal with newspapers, not Ahuizotl.
Caballeron had taken her and Quibble as hostages before, Dash a couple times at least. Dash survived then too. While it’s not a good idea in the real world to go with an abductor, sadly ponies aren’t here in the real world. (Not that kind of pony anyway.) Past experience would show that going with Caballeron would be dangerous, but survivable. She’d be aware she has value as bait as long as she’s alive. Going with him buys her time.
Next time you want to kill someone, please do so in the middle of a town square in broad daylight. It will make it much easier for the authorities to ensure it’s the last time. (Not to mention how that would undo all of Caballeron’s trashing of Daring’s reputation.) The townsponies left the immediate vicinity of the camera, they didn’t vacate the whole town.
Plus while he hates Rainbow Dash, he hates Daring Do more. Killing Rainbow Dash quickly would mean letting the bigger fish get away, even aside from the stupidity it would take to commit a murder in the public square.
Or… They just lost that fight. After dealing with that first wave, they were shown exhausted. More came after them and they ran. They showed that they could hold changelings back, but not forever.
They all left!
And not fighting back would get her killed anyway. What’s the point?!
The point is, ‘Trying’! Whatever threat that Caballeron has, it doesn’t matter if he was ready to kill or not. Rainbow Dash doesn’t know that and shouldn’t care. The whole point of the journey in the first place was that Rainbow Dash was worried that something terrible must’ve happened to Daring Do. If it was for a threat she thought she couldn’t deal with, she would’ve brought the rest of her friends to help. But no. The only one who came along was Pinkie Pie.
This scene turned that whole perspective 180. When Caballeron appears, she acts as if she was expecting no danger at all in this journey. Giving up was certain death. Not giving up would at least give her a better chance of surviving. And as for the tools you said he could use to kill Rainbow Dash there, (or any non-existent bystanders) here’s a question. WHY DIDN’T HE USE THEM THERE, INSTEAD OF WASTING TIME DRAGGING HER TO THE PYRAMID?! If no pony was around to hear her cries of help while she was being dragged away, nopony would be there to hear her screams of pain being killed.
Edited
Discord could have killed her at any point but didn’t. It was obvious that killing his victims wasn’t his thing. What was he going to do to her if she fought back, take her wings away a second time? Or worse, give her a horn? There was no real danger in fighting back. NMM too wasn’t interested in outright killing them.
The Changelings might have been interested in killing them (but probably weren’t; they can’t suck the love out of a corpse). The Sombra soldiers definitely were. But in both cases the ponies were already at war and prepared for a fight. In the Sombra War, they had clearly been fighting for some time already, and the stakes were notably high; Celestia was even recruiting foal soldiers it was so serious. And there was a whole army around, a substantial portion of it apparently under Rainbow Dash’s command. This wasn’t the same Rainbow Dash either; aside from apparently being the commander of a sizable part of Celestia’s military, this Rainbow Dash was a battle-hardened veteran who’d been maimed in combat before. Not fighting back wasn’t really an option. And if it wasn’t for Maud and Pinkamena, Rainbow Dash would have actually gotten killed there anyway; it’s not like fighting back was guaranteed successful. With the changelings, once they opened the door and saw so many more changelings, enough to make the fight hopeless, the Mane Six all gave up without a further fight. Exactly like, oh, I don’t know, what Dash did right here with Caballeron. So yes, perfect example.
What makes Caballeron more dangerous than changelings or Sombra soldiers? At that particular moment, Dash was alone, up close, and unprepared; while Caballeron could be reasonably assumed to have henchponies standing by. There were bystanders around who could have gotten hurt. And Caballeron was known to be willing to murder other ponies. There aren’t a lot of ponies who’ve previously been show to even be capable of that. Henchponies or not, he’s known to be dangerous. (The Sombra soldiers were also shown to be capable of killing, but in a different timeline that never actually took place as far as this Rainbow Dash is concerned. And again, fighting back would have gotten Rainbow Dash killed there, if Maud and Pinkamena hadn’t saved her.) At that moment, Caballeron was winning the battle for the townsponies’ opinions, and simply running/flying away would have cemented that. And lastly, Caballeron is a grave-robbing expert in ancient magical artifacts who was at one point even considering double-crossing Ahuizotl. I don’t know what deadly artifacts he may have had, if any, but neither did Rainbow Dash. We certainly don’t know he didn’t have any.
So to recap, your examples are two times where Dash fought back against opponents who gave no indication of trying to actually kill anyone; one where Dash gave up; and one where fighting back would have resulted in her death if she’d been alone. Since she was alone at that moment, was she supposed to give up like she did against the changelings even though she wasn’t even alone then? Or fight back, lose, and die like she would have against the Sombra soldiers? Giving up wasn’t a bad move when she knew Pinkie and Daring were nearby. (Yes, in the real world, suddenly gouging out Caballeron’s eyes with her car keys would have been a better move, but she’s not in the real world. And while she’s known to be a fighter, the Rainbow Dash of this timeline is probably not capable of actually maiming and killing other ponies.)
Well, if Caballeron is supposed to represent a super dangerous villain that we’re supposed to fear, then what are villains like Nightmare Moon and Discord supposed to be? There was a scene that showed Rainbow Dash not being afraid to take Discord on, and that was when she didn’t have wings! What does Caballeron have that makes him more threatening than Discord?!
Heck, what makes him more dangerous than the examples showed in this picture?
Edited
In previous episode, he was more mercantile, while in this episode, he acted like this:
They’re tomb robbers with who knows what kind of minor magical artifacts at their disposal, and unlike Daring Do, probably very little compunction about using the artifacts they’ve looted to lethal effect. And demonstrably in canon, no compunctions at all about taking hostages. If they don’t get Rainbow Dash, who do they kidnap and torture instead, while Dash runs off to protect her own lovely blue skin? Or would they just shoot her down with the Holy Nike Missile of Antioch that Brother Neigh-nard was carrying?
It’s a show for little children (among others), not Game of Pones. And each episode is only 22 minutes long. They can’t always “show it” how dangerous the bad guy is, the way some shows can; it’s quite reasonable they’d have to settle for it being an informed power with an occasional supporting character (and parody of genuinely dangerous Dr. Belloq, who everyone should recognize already) like Caballeron. What would you have Caballeron do to prove he’s dangerous, that you could actually put in the show? Should he actually slit a villager’s throat? Curse a village foal with a magically fatal wasting disease every ten minutes until Dash returns? Pull out an actual gun? Have Aryanne pull a blanket off an 8.8cm/17 FlaK gun off in the distance and wink at him and Dash? There’s just not much they can fit into the little time of the episode, and get past BS&P, to explain it. But if you realize he’s Belloq ponified, it’s already explained. He’s dangerous, and it’s not safe for her to just fly away. And definitely not fight back while they’re around innocent bystanders.
I would’ve liked if they’d lengthened the episode by a minute or two to put in a canon explanation too (maybe also a cannon explanation?), but that couldn’t happen. It’s a minor point, not worth cutting out anything else to fit it in. (Definitely not any of the Somnambula and the Sphynx stuff; damn they were adorable.)
Her general behaviour was strange. Where’s her bravado? Why she didn’t just flew away at her super-speed? I understand if they had guns, but they didn’t…
Edited
Good point. Good day sir.
Plain and short answer, even Hasbro makes mistakes. But that doesn’t mean we should hate them for it.
Edited
Like I said. “Resistance”. Show, not tell. If that was the reason, they needed to show that. Rainbow wouldn’t think about ‘if’ she could get away, but that she ‘had’ to.
Right, I see where your going. However though, if she “tried” to fly away regardless of the speed, Doctor Caballeron’s henchmen could have bit her tail or tackle her to the ground by cartoon physics.
“Resistance” That’s the keyword we’re thinking here. Whether she’s brave or cowardly, she had the option to fly away, and she doesn’t even do that. And as for your question, “Will she ever be cowardly?” She has, but not to this absurd extent. (Even some of those cowardly moments have conflicted from her previous actions.)
Edited
Good point. At one point though you have to be kipnapped in a show like this regardless if your a hero or not.