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Yes. I know about their numerically high “output” (as questionable a reason that is to deem them acceptable to hate), I’ve had many spirited discussions with people with similar opinions on the same topic who’ve treated me with less animosity in their first responses to me and also did not act like just because I was saying “don’t be nasty” that I was telling them not to give people who actually and legitimately deserve it, a bit of trouble for giving others trouble.
Never said anything about actually enjoying his(V-20’s) pieces, or trying to make exceptions for obvious quality issues/actual laziness/“precious balls of creativity”. At no point did I praise his work as being some pinnacle, but I must admit I’m fascinated by the level of aggression you responded with and I’m wondering what nerves I could’ve possibly struck by just saying that being mean to everyone that a person comes across isn’t helping that person or the people they come into contact with, regardless of if the consistency could be considered a redeeming feature. Gosh I hope it wasn’t the “bronies are basically furries, just primarily with equines” thing because that would explain far too much either way.
I just don’t see the rhyme or reason in anybody actively trying to destroy any artist or even “artist” who fails to meet a preset quality standard so long as they’re not blatantly ripping people off.
Nor do I wish to say that no artist should suffer any criticism or any kind of undesirable feedback. Just malicious feedback, because lots of people lie and exaggerate out of sheer malice and that is false information and thus cannot be acted upon for one’s betterment. Claiming an artist’s x-themed work does not belong on a site about x-themed art also just kind of seems… I dunno, weird.
Christ. I could understand your guff if either V-20 or Robot was ripping people off of like 40 bucks for the same picture, or are actually bad or at least iffy people(you’re free to tear Virus apart in that regard, I’ve got literally no respect for someone who turns their back on one similar fandom for stuff that another fandom does just as often to the individual who then acts like the prior fandom is the only offender). But I’ve seen much more visually appealing artists charge that much for lineart that honestly left me feeling underwhelmed compared to most of their stuff and thinking it looked an awful lot like another picture or 2 or 5 or 10 I saw in their galleries.
So what if V-20 and Robot or pretty much any lower-skill, frequent-post artist has a ridiculous output. Yeah you’re going to see them often but you’re basically hating them for doing their own thing that has nothing to do with you. Yeah I guess it’s hard to avoid unwanted work on other sites, but isn’t there a tag blocking function on here that even works on artist tags? Again. Your hate would make a lot more sense if you actually hated them for being bad people or even if you just said that you feel that they’re ripping people off.
But you only just mentioned their output and hinted vaguely at some objective opinion that apparently justifies legit actual hate toward them but haven’t recited any of their misdeeds and instead just basically argued that they and people like them must be hated because they CAN be hated. Because they post samey stuff often completely for free in addition to cheap commissions that fill a niche. That’d be hilarious if it wasn’t sad and troubling. “This artist posts too often and it bothers me!” How can you not call that subjective? If literally any artist, skilled or not, ripped you and a bunch of friends off of some money I’d have no trouble understanding the angst and that would be pretty morally objective right there because it was something personal, done to you, by a malicious party. Everyone can agree that getting your stuff stolen, or having somebody double back on a deal/commission and take your money with them, isn’t in any way good.
I feel like, in trying to to work the neutral ground, that you have had opportunity to, whether purposeful or accidental, misconstrue my intentions. Which is fine as intention and words often don’t perfectly match, but you were always welcome to ask what I meant if you had qualms.
No I don’t like it when artists post the same thing over and over again. So long as nobody is paying for it though, what’s the matter? Like REALLY, what’s the matter? I don’t get it. I don’t understand this, how an individual can be so overly bothered by someone who has literally not personally talked to that individual and literally done nothing to personally bother that individual save for exist and do stuff that does not involve them, yet still claim they’re not tied to subjective opinion.
In regards to cost of output from other more skilled artists, even open multi-slot YCHs get accepted and treated well despite potentially multiple people all buying a permutation of the same picture that just has the general features of their characters smeared into it, and many of them even going for more than the pittance 5 bucks either V or Robot is asking for.
I don’t get why charging pocket change for what a less gifted artist even acknowledges isn’t that great, is such a bad thing in the face of still literally actually getting the same picture as other people from the same artist. And “they do it better” or “they do it less often” seems like a weak reason to me.
Oh, and “drives”. Popular artist starts a weight gain drive for example, and if enough people donate that artist can easily get way more than their usual commission price for anywhere from 3 to 6 or more pictures. I think I remember seeing a very recent drive that only had 3 images and somehow managed to accrue over 600 dollars assuming everyone donated the most efficient listed cash-to-weight amount. Over 1000 dollars if everyone donated the least efficient. And that drive still isn’t fully done.
Again. Think you jumped the gun a bit. Never said I don’t think artists require criticism, or that all artists should be sheltered from every grain of sand under the sun. Just that niche or “less skilled” artists shouldn’t have to suffer through the reputation and targeting they never hurt anybody enough to deserve. Or like, repeatedly failing to deliver commissions for no reason or something. Anything that actually justifies some degree of malice or ill rep to them. At least let any artist destroy their own livelihood by being awful people, or repeatedly taking on and failing to complete commissions with no adequate reason. Nobody really deserves to suffer or have to take shit from people just because and it’s really screwy for anyone to just be messed with without messing with someone else first, art is just the topic at hand so art is what the topic is handling. I fail to understand how that got interpreted as “Ack! Must protecc all da artistssss from literally everything!” when alls I was saying is “Maybe people should actually… I don’t know, think about the criticism they’re giving before they give it? Anyone can drop a youtube comment-section tier hate comment, that’s why the comment sections have the reputation they do, you think it’s any different for DA, FA, or even Derpi?”.
My point is that destructive criticism on the internet is pretty much never given with any genuine intention to benefit the artist/creator(hence why it’s called destructive, all it’s intended to do is harm, unlike firm-but-constructive criticism which can sound cold or rough but still has SOMETHING an artist can use) and is just given by someone who only wants the benefit of being able to shit on somebody else and sometimes even with intent to mess up their day. So more mellow/less trolly people should not join in with that behaviour just because “everyone else” is doing it or it looks fun or is deemed acceptable. Actual genuine criticism that is phrased well and meant well no matter the tone, as far as I’ve seen, is a lot rarer than either blind yes-men/rabid fans or similarly blind no-men/rabid haters.
Although it seems you interpreted “Huh. Went a whole mini-rant without chiding you for being intolerant and selective despite being part of a fandom that is supposed to make a point of being accepting and tolerant. Neat” as being a tad more condescending and aggressive than intended, as opposed to how I originally intended it.
I can accept responsibility for that considering I’m no stranger to the internet, and so I shall rephrase. “I did not opt for low-hanging fruit I’ve seen used before so many times, in regards to dealing with anybody from the MLP fandom. I did not aimlessly chide a person for not following a set of morals and rules said person is most inclined to obey as part of said fandom, without context or just basically trying to shame them into doing so. Instead, I tried to with some small effort on my part convey reasons I felt were significant enough to have some bearing on adopting a calmer and less spiteful mindset towards people that literally do nothing to affect one personally. I’m happy I could do this as I would not expect myself to be taken seriously if I either erupted into baseless accusations when challenged, or just basically tried to dodge the argument altogether by giving them something they couldn’t respond to without looking morally unsound”. There. Was not intended to look like a middle finger before being refined, but in retrospect it kind of seems like I was destined to get a middle finger back even if I left that out.
Exclude one “mediocre” artist. Then other “mediocre” artists get excluded simply because. Eventually the whole process ends up excluding artists who’ve started out a little on the unskilled side because of quality-enforcing zealots who think that “unskilled now” means “unskilled forever”, or “unique” is “ugly”, or “below average” is “completely unacceptable”. Those artists then have a valuable channel of response and exposure taken away, and it becomes even harder to make a business out of art, which itself also cuts away opportunity for them to refine their craft. Aside from such a message also possibly being interpreted as “We literally don’t like you, and don’t want you contributing”.
Aside from the above though. It’s kinda mean to just arbitrarily allow/disallow site based on personal whims, and not according to say… Intent to cause grief/flaming, intent to troll, intent to spark political angst on-site. Stuff like that.
And of course, there are the numbnuts who’d take the idea of artist’s content not being allowed to be posted to the site/acceptable to hate on, as some kind of sign that they’re okay to pick on/hate/send death threats. Which, quite interestingly I’ve seen with e621 and two artists in recent memory who have basically closed their accounts and left the furry art scene entirely. I’m not sure of their individual motivations for poofing, but one of them was a pretty decent artist who just drew things that made some weenies with small weenies uncomfortable (despite liking similar and even more non-con kinds of pictures which included normal-sized junk) which caused them to act solely on their insecurities and do things that made the artist feel increasingly unwelcome everywhere, even off of e621.
I’d be more concerned with V-20 being a blatant pony hater now who, quite seriously uses the care bears of all things as a vessel for his anti-MLP grudge. And he claims it’s due to bronies giving him “grief”, Which I don’t understand considering he’s a furry, and bronies are PRETTY MUCH horse-fixated furries. He’s been a furry way longer than he was ever into ponies, and I’m sure that he’s received much more shit from “quality concerned” individuals much like yourself but who just happen to be furries, and before the FiM fandom was ever a thing too. So to my perception, it’s like he just turned around one day and arbitrarily decided “right then, I don’t like ponies anymore, ponies are gay and not in the fun way”.
It’s not like he requested his art shouldn’t be posted here, and there is no better way to spite him for probably acting on a whim he was planning on acting on at some point regardless considering how little prodding(in so little time I might add) it took to turn him anti-brony, than to enjoy his stuff after he’s erased it all from his own galleries. Surely, if nothing else, you could appreciate and even get on board with that if you hate his work so much.
…Huh. Went a whole mini-rant without chiding you for being intolerant and selective despite being part of a fandom that is supposed to make a point of being accepting and tolerant. Neat.